Edition 1 only awarded trophies to top finishers. No experience and kudos were given. I'm going to assume no one would object to kudos being added as an award and I'll plan on eventually adding it. The more interesting questions have to do with experience as a prize:
- Should bots receive exp as a prize?
- If bots should receive exp as a prize, how much should it be?
- If bots should receive exp as a prize, should it be optional?
Here are the main arguments (that I'm aware of, please provide others) for and against exp as a prize:
- For: It helps prevent staleness in categories by forcibly leveling those at the top end of the category out of it. E.g. a level 150 bot would only be able to dominate category 4 (levels 141-150) for so long before being given enough exp to hit level 151.
- For: Someone could forcibly level your bot via attacking it regardless of whether the tourney gives exp as a prize.
- For: Category 1 bots would pretty much always want exp.
- Against: It's a nuisance to be leveled out of a category if your main interest is in building tourney bots. Having to periodically reset and re-level your bot is a tedious chore.
Keep these points, and others that other players may raise, in mind when answering the questions at the top.
For what it's worth, my original answers when designing the tournament had been "yes, all top finishers should always receive exp, whether they want to or not, and it should 100% of the top level of the category for 1st place, 50% for 2nd place, 25% for 3rd place, and 10% for 4th-10th place". I recognized that probably would have been unpopular with some people though (for the reasons above) and didn't go through with it. I'm curious what others think though.
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Considering the manner in which the tourney is, where as it's a 1 fight between everyone, the chance of there being upsets to the "so called" best build in each category gives credence to their not being xp given.
You don't force a boxer (only example I have in a short time) into the next weight class because he dominates everyone. You force everyone else to step up their game and knock the #1 on his ass.
I feel that this should be the same aspect. A tourney bot shouldn't be given xp, simply because other people don't want to take the time and effort to build a bot that is at perfection, and would rather have that bot pushed out of their category so they have a better chance of winning. They'd have the same chance of winning if they took the same time the other people did building said tourney bots.
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If you give the winner of cat 1 a decent chunk of exp, you are going some way to solidifying him as the winner for months to come. Even 20% of a level per month will make it much harder for anyone to ever beat him.
As to categories getting stale if the winner isn't out leveled, realistically the only thing that means is another bot with the same build will come along and dominate in the same way. Only way to stop something like that would be to have the level categories change.
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Even if the distribution was 20, 15, 10, 5 it would be more manageable then 100, 50, 25, 10.
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Ohh fuck off fishwick you just want you clan to dominate tourneys with Benny and Rene providing the goods.
Exp should be given to out level those winning tournaments make them move up to the next cat or make them re make the bot
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in bots2 you were not allowed to write post directed at one person, we used botmail for that :)
(although, I guess this is directed at one person - hypocrite I am)
was xp not given as a prize this time? why did that change?
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make the xp reward 10% and optional. Then those who want to maintain their place in a category can do that and those not among the top lvls of a category who could use the xp boost can also get something out of it.
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in bots2 you were not allowed to write post directed at one person, we used botmail for that :)
As long as it sorta stays on topic, of course you respond to another person's remark.
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Xp reward reward must be set and it shouldnt be optional. How big it should be, its another question. Yes, it would reward cat 1 winners, but it also makes sure, that one bot wont dominate any other cat for to long. In bots2 we had XP rewards for winners. And still my bot was able to dominate one cat for 5 or 6 tournament editions. And now when people can reset they bots, it wouldnt be a problem at all. Winners only would have to make more effort to dominate and its good thing.
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Leader, calm down dear, it's only a discussion. My point, if you bothered to read it correctly, was that a big chunk of exp given would allow Otto to run away with the win every month. Surely I would support the exp if all I cared about was my clan winning? I'd like Otto to get a huge free chunk of exp to help him stay top level, but I don't think it's fair, regardless of what clan I'm in.
I didn't direct my point at lower levels, because quite frankly leveling will do nothing to stop Benny and Rene, they have the best structures available to make an exact replica every time their existing bot gets leveled. And, considering the effort they put in this time around, I'm sure they'll do that each time they need to.
People can be members of clans without every thought they have being dedicated to trying to win. But good job keeping civilized.
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if someone has the goods... it seems like they would dominate regardless of how experience is divided? I do not understand leaders argument..
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Maybe I shpuldmt reply pissed but ,my argument is ended hasn't gave exp out this round it should be given because if I have the best build workshopped its gonna be pretty op every tourney right? And every time tourney starts that bits Gina have a great chance of winning
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ill be happy with anything, even with 10% of current level(which is still 161 Bil of xp)
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for me, regarding the exp rewards, it shouldn't be optional, be applied on all categories (to avoid staleness), and it should be fixed amount.
instead of having it at percentage reward (like 10% or so), it should be a fixed reward (like 50B exp or such for cat 1 winner). this way, it should be fair enough even if the category winner is at lower level.
the fixed exp reward should be discussed thoroughly so that it isn't that high or too low.
just my thoughts about it. no offense on those people that opposes it.
[khael]
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Should bots receive exp as a prize?
Yes
If bots should receive exp as a prize, how much should it be?
>50% so that any one bot cant win the same category more then twice.
If bots should receive exp as a prize, should it be optional?
No
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Give the losers the exp so they can lvl up and try to do better in another cat :P
Seriously though, I can see a exp reward of around 10% of a lvl could work. Non-optional.
And I think it way way to early to be talking about certain bots dominating their cat´s. Let us see what happens after 6 more tourneys.
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Gratz on the tourney win benny :)
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no xp or kudos as a prize.
with resets leveling out of a cat is not a huge obstacle. just reset & rebuild.
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Do you want experience with your tournament victory
☠No
☑ Yes
Do you want kudos with your tournament victory
☑ No
☠Yes
Do you want a shiny medal with your tournament victory
☠No
☑ Yes
Or something, I dunno
~Erica out
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oooh get you erica with your flash check boxes!
jans will be so jealous :)
/impressed
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If bots should receive exp as a prize, how much should it be?
50% so that any one bot cant win the same category more then twice.
lol, sure.... give the cat 1 winner 50% of his level...
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i'd say 5% at most if you did get exp
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+1 for getting exp as a prize.
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I vote no. In bots2, the xp and kudos were given more because there wasn't actually anything more valuable to give as a reward. In bots4, I think the trophies for the individual and clan are more than enough. No bot actually wants xp aside from cat 1, as was mentioned, and I don't think that the winner there necessarily needs an xp boost compared to the rest of the field.
Besides, to win a tournament you pretty much need to make a workshop-freaked bot, which are completely useless aside from competing in tournaments and being dumped on. I think that much dedication should be rewarded, rather than punished by periodically forcing that bot to reset.
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i would like to see xp as a prize, atleast in Cat 1 and the current Cat2
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It's interesting how the only posts that give justification to their stance in this thread are the ones not in favour of xp from tourneys.
Anyway, if xp is to be given to any cat, the one cat that should not receive it is cat 1. This game already has too many rewards that favour more active/experienced players (eg. top x trophies), without making it easier for the player already dominating the category to level up.
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I guess escapism like staleness... You all oppose anything that stop you guys from dominating..
Exp should be given id be happy even if it was they received the normal regular amount they would per fight win or loss everyone gains exp
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watch your words Leader, not everybody has the same opinion
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Olly you can find ulterior motives in any post you like, but the fact remains that forcing someone to reset their bot does not guarantee there will be a new winner the next tourney. It only takes a day or two to remake a tourney bot for the most part, which is easily doable within the month required before the next tourney. All giving xp does is reduce the tourney bot-building process to a chore that needs to be repeated every few months.
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But it force you to do something. You have to spend these 2 days while remaking bot. Otherwise you can build your bot once and leave it like that, while winning tournaments. Its either xp reward which will force people to spend time on they bots in order to win or changing tourney categories each tournament. And i believe xp reward still better option.
/Ratty
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I guess the question is, do people actually want to spend time re-making their tourney bots? I mean, it will be a massive pain in the ass, not to mention a major 'fuck you' to people willing to put in the time and effort making specialised tourney bots.
The other option of randomising the cats sounds like a better way of preventing staleness. The players who are the most dedicated and build the most tourney bots will have the best chance to win.
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The other option of randomising the cats sounds like a better way of preventing staleness. The players who are the most dedicated and build the most tourney bots will have the best chance to win.
^Fully agree
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Agreed, different builds will win and require additional thought. Levelling bots out of a category as a punishment doesn't change anything, that build will continue to win for the rest of the games lifetime, just with a reset or new bot.
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I was under the impression we would get EXP in tournaments I for one set up my tourney bots to gain exp and level so I'll still be in the same category.
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