complaints

This thread is about bozanstvo, formerly level 166, HoF level #8.

Unlike previous threads where I divulged exactly what I did to catch someone, I'm going to be a little more vague this time. Here are the logs for this bot before I did anything (IP stripped):

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:00:15 -0400] "GET /train/22/64752 HTTP/1.1" 200 8370
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:00:28 -0400] "GET /train/22/28770 HTTP/1.1" 200 8547
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:00:41 -0400] "GET /train/22/24952 HTTP/1.1" 200 8507
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:00:56 -0400] "GET /train/22/58866 HTTP/1.1" 200 8779
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:01:14 -0400] "GET /train/22/6468 HTTP/1.1" 200 9490
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:01:38 -0400] "GET /train/22/7436 HTTP/1.1" 200 8818
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:01:49 -0400] "GET /showroom HTTP/1.1" 200 57054
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:01:55 -0400] "GET /train/22/45655 HTTP/1.1" 200 8266
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:02:06 -0400] "GET /train/22/19438 HTTP/1.1" 200 8947
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:02:27 -0400] "GET /train/22/48419 HTTP/1.1" 200 8510
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:02:42 -0400] "GET /showroom HTTP/1.1" 200 49640
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:02:43 -0400] "GET /train/22/55589 HTTP/1.1" 200 9536
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:02:45 -0400] "GET /showroom HTTP/1.1" 200 53327
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:03:10 -0400] "GET /train/22/46480 HTTP/1.1" 200 8873
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:03:28 -0400] "GET /train/22/48171 HTTP/1.1" 200 8669
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:03:40 -0400] "GET /showroom HTTP/1.1" 200 56763
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:03:42 -0400] "GET /train/22/56085 HTTP/1.1" 200 8707
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:03:57 -0400] "GET /train/22/11325 HTTP/1.1" 200 8792
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:13 -0400] "GET /train/22/40613 HTTP/1.1" 200 9170
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:35 -0400] "GET /train/22/39633 HTTP/1.1" 200 8438

Nothing too unusual. Then I made a small change in the way the battle page appears only for that bot:

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:35 -0400] "GET /train/22/39633 HTTP/1.1" 200 8438

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:46 -0400] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 77602
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:49 -0400] "GET /train HTTP/1.1" 200 40078
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:04:52 -0400] "GET /train/22/15624 HTTP/1.1" 200 8637

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:07 -0400] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 77602
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:09 -0400] "GET /train HTTP/1.1" 200 40078
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:12 -0400] "GET /train/22/19795 HTTP/1.1" 200 8625

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:28 -0400] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 77603
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:30 -0400] "GET /train HTTP/1.1" 200 40078
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:32 -0400] "GET /train/22/11011 HTTP/1.1" 200 8547

(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:46 -0400] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 77602
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:48 -0400] "GET /train HTTP/1.1" 200 40048
(ip) - - [28/Aug/2011:23:05:51 -0400] "GET /train/22/59010 HTTP/1.1" 200 8620

I added extra line breaks to make it clear what was going on. The script is clearly unable to process what would have been unnoticeable to a human. It reverts back to some rule where it navigates to the home page, to the train index, and then back to the train. It then fails again at the end of the battle, and repeats. I went back and forth on this for a little longer to be 100% sure. Turning the battle page back to normal resulted in normal clicking; putting the change back in resulted in the above loop.

The bot has been reset and locked now. Additionally, the user has been IP banned because their script has gone haywire and is currently spamming the server every second or two. This will be lifted when they turn the script off after waking up.

This is a message for anyone currently cheating or thinking of doing so: If you're using a script, knock it off. You will be caught. It's extremely easy for me to make subtle, completely invisible changes in only your environment and catch you in the act. I am becoming increasingly efficient at this and I enjoy doing it.

Thanks to neps for pointing out the suspicious behavior that led to this bust.

Nice, another cheat down :)

Like a fucking boss. Nice Ender!

And btw, this bot was owned by a well-known bots2 player, Dustin, maybe better known as Total Eclipse. He's not a bad guy and I don't mean to drag his name through the mud (too much), but I'm announcing this as part of the "public shaming" component of cheater punishment. Justice will be served, even to friends.

If all you're going to do is cheat, why even bother playing at all?

autoclickers should learn that they cannot be as stealthy as this...

http://imgur.com/VJuzP

FYI, I've reset/locked 8 additional bots belonging to this player:

• Vires, level 101
• Megan Fox, level 125
• Extra 3, level 35
• Forever, level 110
• Always, level 113
• Sandslash, level 66
• Horror, level 45
• Katana, level 47

And just to clear up what I mean by "belonged to", the majority of the played time on those bots had come from the cheater's IP. I've been informed that it's possible those bots had been sold, which raises the interesting question of what should happen to bots that were built using a script and then later sold to some unsuspecting victim. The answer isn't clear to me on this.

If you think this happened to you here, don't freak out. Contact me and we'll talk. Everything is backed up regularly and many actions are reversible. I'm not saying I will restore them, but I'm not saying I won't either. A clear policy needs to be established first and it's not yet clear to me how to handle this potential scenario.

I made a separate thread for discussing the above scenario generically:

http://bots4.net/forum/4/2341

It seems this is actually happening here though. I don't want anyone's names to be tarnished unfairly, so I'll disclose all I know. Kerrod bought Megan Fox and Sandslash from Alan. I don't know how Alan acquired them, but the majority of played time had come from Dustin/TE, hence the locks/resets.

So as for this case, I think the fair thing to do is to reverse the trades. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe any real money was exchanged. I don't have all the details though nor even who was involved in these trades since the bots seem to have passed through multiple hands, so please come forward with details if you were involved.

Good, another fucktard busted!

I'm wondering though, does this mean the recaptcha checks are successfully passed by these scripts?

Yeah, and I had a feeling people would be wondering about that sooner or later. There are at least a few ways of getting by it that I know of, the saddest being outsourcing it to third-world countries via mechanical turk.

I can't believe people cheat and think they're not going to get caught. Ender is the All-seeing eye!

Very nice

o_O
I can't believe Dustin was doing this. Really surprised me. Anyway, nice anti-cheat work Ed, keep it up :)

I can't express how great it is to have a developer who swiftly punishes cheats once he has identified them. Great job wiggin =)

good work. fuck the cheaters

Well done Ed !

Well done \o/

well fuck.

Well, doing those things witch Wiggin did, its... almost crazy ... but also, it helped.. it just mean that we all need to go crazy at some situations. A FUCKING WORLD NEED TO GO CRAZY. GO. anyway. nice job ▲ ▲ ▲

DNM can you translate please? :P

So many ambiguities. I the context of this thread I believe:

Wiggen's reaction might seem over the top but it's set the right example. Fight the cheators! Fuck them where they live! Nice job, triforce fail.

Nicely paraphrased.

... the saddest being outsourcing it to third-world countries via mechanical turk.

Lol, the way of our world. Outsourcing.

* Vires -- Dustin
* Megan Fox -- Bot made for blitz ( 2 stars )
* Extra 3 -- My personal bot
* Forever -- Bot made for Ayatollah ( 2 stars )
* Always -- Bot made for Seven Stars ( 2 stars )
* Sandslash -- Bot made for Blitz ( 3 bots : 2 stars, So 2/3 stars?)
* Horror -- Bot made for Rivan ( not done )
* Katana -- Bot made for Rivan ( not done )

There ya go...

Sorry Alan, I am having trouble following. Are you saying only Vires was made by Dustin and that you made all the others, which were sold for 8 or 9 stars total? This doesn't add up because the majority of played time on all the locked bots came from Dustin, not you, hence the lock.

• Vires -- Dustin
• Megan Fox -- Bot made for blitz ( 2 stars )
• Extra 3 -- My personal bot
• Forever -- Bot made for Ayatollah ( 2 stars )
• Always -- Bot made for Seven Stars ( 2 stars )
• Sandslash -- Bot made for Blitz ( 3 bots : 2 stars, So 2/3 stars?)
• Horror -- Bot made for Rivan ( not done )
• Katana -- Bot made for Rivan ( not done )

I made all the bots. He did play most of the time on Megan Fox, Forever, and Always. While I finished about 12 other bots.

Okay I've been talking with everyone involved in private, but I think it's best we do this here because I can't keep it all straight. I'm not familiar with the details of your trades, so you really have to spell it out for me if we're going to be able to reverse this.

For example:

Trade 1
Between: Alice and Bob
Traded: Alice's 1 star for Bob's bot B

Trade 2
Between: Bob and Eve
Traded: Bob's 2 stars for Eve's bots E and F

I'm leaving for work now and will be offline until I get home, but hopefully we can sort this out.

Trade : Seven Stars

• 2 stars
• Bot : Always

Trade : Ayatollah

• 2 stars
• Bot : Forever

Trade : Blitz

• 2 stars
• Bot : Megan Fox

Trade : Blitz

• 2 stars (3 bots)
• Bot : Sandslash is the only on to get caught. So it's worth 2/3 stars.

All bots were made by me except Vires of course.

This is a message for anyone currently cheating or thinking of doing so: If you're using a script, knock it off. You will be caught. It's extremely easy for me to make subtle, completely invisible changes in only your environment and catch you in the act. I am becoming increasingly efficient at this and I enjoy doing it.

Possibly you should have random checks on players with played time/day that is higher than normal. Would it be that hard to automate something like this?

You mentioned neps said there was suspicious behaviour, but I'm sure there are players with less than suspicious behaviour that cheat.

Hey draoi, what is "normal" playing time?

30minutes, a hour, 8 hours?

I can say my playtime ranges from 15min to 20 hours, depending on what i wanna do :)

If i have a day off, and wanna play bots/watch tv shows all day long, that is what i will do.

Doubt i have been online 20hours straight yet though.. when i take a crap.. it usually logs me out :P

...

tmi!

Bah, it`s the most natural thing, even women do it :)

Possibly you should have random checks on players with played time/day that is higher than normal. Would it be that hard to automate something like this?

I think it's difficult to come up with something automated. Perhaps a few indicators to make a quick selection of 'suspicious accounts' to investigate further, but catching them doing it will mostly likely depend on human observation and interference.

And good thing Ender enjoys the game of hunting :) When cheaters see people are caught and that punishment is severe (loss of accounts, loss of stars), the majority will be too scared to try/continue.

even women do it

That's not true. Is it?

^ i hope not...

They do.. but they usually prefer the romantic/dramatic ones.. the boring ones in my opinion.

O.o

I'm lost now, a romantic/dramatic shit?

I dont think you could get more intimate than taking a crap together.

While watching a romantic show? ehm.. think i will mute myself for now.

lol I presume you don't go on many dates Smeagol :P

True that, as i dont need to go on dates :)

Well, good thing my autoclicker that steals dota keys as I play dota is still undetected.

I paid two stars for Megan fox and two stars for three level 65 bots. As far as I knew I had hired Alan.

Let's see if I can piece this puzzle together...

Trade 1
Between: Alan and Seven Stars
Traded: Alan's bot "Always" for Seven Stars' 2 stars

Trade 2
Between: Alan and Ayatollah
Traded: Alan's bot "Forever" for Ayatollah's 2 stars

Trade 3
Between: Alan and Blitz
Traded: Alan's bot "Megan Fox" for Blitz's 2 stars

Trade 4
Between: Alan and Blitz
Traded: Alan's bots "Sandslash", (uninvolved), and (uninvolved) for Blitz's 2 stars

So if I understand correctly, 8 stars need to go from Alan back to Blitz? I still don't understand how this makes sense though because that seems like Alan's getting the short end of the stick. He's forking over stars when it's TE that did the cheating, so this doesn't add up to me.

Err wait, no...2 to Seven Stars, 2 to Ayatollah, 4 to Blitz. Which makes even less sense to me. Can one of you just please figure this out. I asked for a pretty simple list format when I left for work this morning and only one of you even attempted to give me the info. If you're not going to help me, I can't help you. I think all of this proves that having me broker/audit every trade in order to be able to reverse them in the event of you dealing with cheaters isn't feasible. My time is too limited to be spent doing these sort of administrative things.

</rant>

Okay I think this is resolved now. We worked out on IRC 2 to Seven Stars, 2 to Ayatollah, 3 to Blitz. These are all moved now from Alan/TE's accounts.

And yes, I'm a fan of checking more on active players. I honestly don't care if you autoclick for 10 minutes everyday because that's not going to affect other people. If you're a top player though who's on for hours every day, you can expect to be "tested" more often. I've sometimes thought about a tiered anti-cheat system where certain components aren't even present until you reach a certain threshold.

For example:

• Online for 0-60 minutes: no anti-cheat devices
• Online for 1-3 hours: fake links
• Online for 3-10 hours: fake links, captchas
• Online for 10+ hours: fake links, captchas, manual spot checks

These are completely made-up values with no bearing on reality or what I'd actually implement, they're just to illustrate my point. The actual system wouldn't be well-defined like this since this would obviously allow you to ride limits to avoid detection. I like this though because it spares casual legitimate players from anti-cheat device nonsense without really sacrificing anything.

Anyway, this sort of overhaul won't come for awhile. Just thinking.

I'm terrible at test taking... I don't need tests :P

more unreadable captchas ftw ^^

I would agree that more anti-cheating measures would be better, the comfort of knowing Ender would never implement something that might accidentally "lock" clean players is good enough, and we've all seen how he really does his research before taking action, not just bundling all people who "click fast," or something into the cheater category.

Maybe Alan is cheator as well...

Ender:

Please continue with the way you're doing it now. Automated things are too easy to by-pass. It wont be too hard making a bot relog every xx minutes and therefor hurdle over the things you listed. Tho Im sure you can apply it after a total pr. day instead.

I know your investigation takes more time ofc, but it will beat automated ones all day, and Im sure that this community will love you for it. It is something that Rolf barely or never did.

+1!

Agree on that, i also think that with the community`s reports of odd "behaviour", will make Ender want to check it out by himself, as he said he like beeing the "detective" :)

Anyways, whatever will be done i am sure it will be good either way, i trust Ender will do a good job.

Well said, Tintin, fully agreed.

in wondering, neps, why did you suspect the dude? Help us all catch more cheaters xD

sorry for the bump btw :)

His bot opened all bmails instantly, the moment it trained again, but never replied.

But for the most part I just hated the fact that he was the same coloured name as me. So I made up a story, took a shot in the dark and was right.

^^

making up stories? excellent way to go about it neps.

haha ^^

I was kidding btw, his bot really did do that. Plus he zoomed up the HoF so fast, overtaking a lot of trainers both in trains and level too quickly. If his bot wasn't a real shitty build it would have most certainly gotten higher.

He was WAY to busy with real life to worry about "camping" good equipment or adding stats.

Well said, August-Tintin. I hope September-Tintin agrees.

oh snap!

Fight! Fight! Fight!